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#611389 - 07/21/17 07:25 PM ethernet over copper  
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jsaad Offline
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I have a location where we can't get the cable company for internet, no verizon fios available. Customer is interested in ethernet over copper, which I'm told bonds multiple dsl circuits into a single pipe.

Curious if anyone else uses such service and their experience?
Provider would be Windstream.

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#611396 - 07/22/17 12:06 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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After checking out Windstream I have no idea how they get service to the customer's premises. I would direct your question to them.

-Hal


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#611402 - 07/22/17 01:24 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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Are they considering bonded T1 circuits for Internet access service?


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#611405 - 07/22/17 03:05 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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#611414 - 07/23/17 03:07 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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Customer of mine had EoC from Windstream here in Ohio. 3 bonded pairs, he eventually upgraded to fiber for more bandwidth but he seemed to like the service.

Last edited by jeffmoss26; 07/23/17 03:07 AM.

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#611439 - 07/23/17 11:50 PM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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Windstream provides bonded T1 circuits to provide usable ethernet service. Not FiOS or Cable, but a whole lot better than DSL. We have a health clinic that has 22 branches and Windstream connected all 23 (the main site and 22 remote sites) with bonded T1s and they worked rather well. No speed demons, but the circuits handled the data requirements of these medical facilities very well.

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#611446 - 07/24/17 01:27 PM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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Glad to hear the positive responses. Windstream says they get dsl circuits from their 'vendor' which I believe is megapath via verizon and then bond them. They take 10 pair, use only 7 and keep 3 in reserve in case of failure.

This location is a city area in north new jersey where the cable company and telephone company have decided not to invest in any new facilities. The customer is left with asymmetrical dsl from Verizon. The cable facilities are ok, nothing is new.

#611447 - 07/24/17 01:57 PM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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Quote
This location is a city area in north new jersey where the cable company and telephone company have decided not to invest in any new facilities.


My point is that the service is dependent on Verizon copper (or the LEC in the area) which we all know is going to crap. Nowhere does Windstream mention that little fact but instead make it look like they have their own network throughout the US. So you just assume that they provide facilities directly to your premises which is not the case. So just because someone had a good experience with Windstream doesn't mean that you will or they will continue to.

-Hal

Last edited by hbiss; 07/24/17 02:00 PM.

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#611454 - 07/24/17 04:10 PM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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Yes, that's the real problem. Excellent point.

My other concern is will Verizon bring in new cable pairs, we shall see.

#611455 - 07/24/17 05:42 PM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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I seriously doubt it.

-Hal


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#611463 - 07/24/17 08:48 PM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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I seriously doubt ANYONE thinks Windstream or, for that matter, ANY provider is constructing facility in Verizon's or any other operating company's territory. We all know if it's Verizon's territory, the transport is Verizon. No matter what the claims are, the bottom line is the operating company owns the copper plant and everyone else rents facility from them.

An interesting development in western PA is that in areas where Verizon does not have FiOS, and the cable is in bad shape, Verizon is installing new copper. It's not wholesale, across the board, but in selected areas. It may have something to do with the PA PUC because I doubt Verizon has found their conscience recently.

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#611468 - 07/25/17 02:41 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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For large customers, CLECS can and do install their own fiber, thus, bypassing LEC facilities. My former employer, Level (3), is one such example. Copper is a different story though.


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#611469 - 07/25/17 02:44 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: Rcaman]  
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Originally Posted by Rcaman
I seriously doubt ANYONE thinks Windstream or, for that matter, ANY provider is constructing facility in Verizon's or any other operating company's territory.


We actually have (or had?) a company called Lightpath here that provided their own fiber to the premises. I think they were owned by Cablevision. I remember their equipment racks in cages in each building's basement. From the basement to each customer they installed copper. This was many years ago before Fios or the cable companies began using fiber trunking. They only served corporate parks and such.


-Hal


CALIFORNIA PROPOSITION 65 WARNING: Some comments made by me are known to the State of California to cause irreversible brain damage and serious mental disorders leading to confinement.
#611470 - 07/25/17 02:45 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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I would doubt that it is a bonded T1 deployment. More likely, it is an HDSL or SHDSL deployment. We've used them in the past with various Hatteras, Overture, and Adtran gear. usually you get about 5 MB per pair and can bond up to four pairs to a max of 20 MB if needed. Provided they are short loops. This is what I've experienced using EoC anyways.

#611594 - 07/28/17 03:26 AM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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Ironically, with all of this talk about Verizon letting their copper plant go to hell (and it is in most areas), in their former Bell areas east of Richmond, VA, they have scrapped plans for FiOS deployment. Of course, the CATV provider is gobbling their customers up left and right. Not to be outdone, Verizon has invested heavily in some beautiful new copper plant; mostly aerial, where you can see the quality of the workmanship. They have even placed new drops and NIDs to most buildings. It's quite refreshing.

I ran into a Verizon technician out there who was working at a cross box a year or two ago. I commented on this situation and he enlightened me. He said that they offered generous relocation packages to their best copper technicians from all over the region. I have to tell you, it really shows. It's like artwork, something we rarely see anymore. It almost brings a tear to my eye when riding down those roads and seeing a 900 pair cable that's as neatly routed and bent as a conduit. There really is something to be said about quality workmanship.

#611867 - 08/09/17 09:59 PM Re: ethernet over copper [Re: jsaad]  
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In NYC, several Companies do there owe fiber into buildings.
RCN
Spectrum
Cablevision
And some others


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