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#155349 03/14/06 08:11 AM
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Jason M Offline OP
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hello.. today, after moving an extension on the system, 4 digital ports have stopped working suddenly, for no apparant reason. We have a td-1232 setup in 8x32 configuration plus a TVP-100.

We have had a similar problem occur before years ago, where 8 ports stopped working (all 8 ports on an expansion card) and we had to replace the card (under warranty, happened shortly after we had the card installed) but this time the 4 ports that have quit are on the base unit, ports 13-16. So happens that one of these was the port that was moved today (15) Ports 1-12 are still ok, as are ports 17-32 (on the expansion cards) and all the analog ports seem ok.

I reassigned 3 of the unlucky folks to 'spare' ports on the system, but the 4th is SOL cause we're out of ports now. When a phone (Digital) is plugged into one of the affected ports, it makes clicking sounds and all it's lights flash in unison.

If anyone has any idea what's up with this, I would greatly appreciate any insight. Can it be fixed? Has anyone seen this before?

Thanks in advance for any replies!

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#155350 03/14/06 08:23 AM
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did you try a reset since the move?

#155351 03/14/06 08:27 AM
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After this problem became apparent, I did power-cycle the system, if that's what you mean by reset. I did not clear the system settings, if that's what you mean.

#155352 03/14/06 08:32 AM
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did you short data pairs at any time with your
punchdown tool thats enough to knock out 4 ports at once a .a backup and a default and a reload
may or may not solve your problem.

#155353 03/14/06 08:41 AM
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Can't say I noticed shorting anything while working at the BIX block, but can't 100% rule it out either.. never know..

#155354 03/14/06 08:48 AM
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hmm.. just talked to the office rats who were moving their cubes.. apparantly, for some genius reason, somebody plugged their phone cord from one wall jack into the other.. apparantly there was a wal-mart M-F extension or something and they plugged that end in first before disconnecting the other end from the wall.. nice.. trying to move their phones around thinking the 'phone IS the extension' grr

so that means the data pair from jack 27 were connected to the data pair from jack 15! suppose that might have fried something in the base unit?

#155355 03/14/06 09:07 AM
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I hate when that happens

#155356 03/14/06 09:11 AM
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at least you can point the finger at them instead
of you

#155357 03/14/06 09:17 AM
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lol.. well like I said.. we've actually had expansion cards just go south for no apparant reason before.. and that time it happened when there was no work being done.. so maybe I'll be a nice guy and say it 'just happened like before' smile

but seriously, do you think there is any possibility of repair for these 4 ports? or are we fried for good?

if we're fried, guess my only option to regain sufficient ports is to add a second cabinet.. unless you have another suggestion?

#155358 03/14/06 11:03 AM
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I've seen this happen several times with the TD's sometimes if you leave power off long enough it comes back. I've had some that left power off for 15-30 min. and no luck, but then check it on bench a few days later and it works. One of the reasons I stopped sell Panasonic long ago.


Merritt

Business Telephones & Equipment + Commercial Audio/Video Products
Commercial Communications . . . Turner, Maine
If it was built after 1980 don't expect it to work right.
#155359 03/14/06 11:53 AM
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I have an 8x that got soaked by a burst pipe
and dried it out with a blow dryer
defaulted it and its been my office system now for 2 years

#155360 03/14/06 11:54 AM
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well, seems after the day has gone by, 3 of the 4 ports have come back alive, at least mostly.. the 1 that was cross-connected is still dead, but the others work most of the time, but occasionally disconnect calls, so I'm told by the one guy still using one of the formerly-dead ports (the previously SOL guy)

#155361 03/14/06 03:32 PM
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I learned that black/yellow shorting issue on my first KX-TD install years ago. We just wanted to test it to see how sensitive it was. Dumb idea. We lost that port for good.

Panasonic systems have always been really sensitive to shorts, even on the analog systems. A short on an analog KX-T system would result in the loss of 8 stations at a time. After the short was cleared and things cooled off, the ports would come back up.

I haven't seen a shorted second pair on the TD systems knock out a block of extensions, but I suppose anything is possible.


Ed Vaughn, MBSWWYPBX
#155362 03/14/06 05:07 PM
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jason M:
[QB] hello.. today, after moving an extension on the system, 4 digital ports have stopped working suddenly, for no apparant reason.

I do advance replacement "repairs" on the internal station and CO boards. Gimme a yell.

-Joe
www.usedpanasonicphones.com
(775) 888 9292

#155363 03/14/06 05:24 PM
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I stayed late after tonight, did a fresh system backup, ran the full set of self-tests, turned the thing off for 10 minutes.. everything seems ok except the PT tone test didn't do anything on the fried port (15) which also still doesn't work. The other 3 ports which previously didn't work do seem to work again now. Lovely.

#155364 03/14/06 06:38 PM
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Quote
Originally posted by ev607797:
I learned that black/yellow shorting issue on my first KX-TD install years ago. We just wanted to test it to see how sensitive it was. Dumb idea. We lost that port for good.

Panasonic systems have always been really sensitive to shorts, even on the analog systems. A short on an analog KX-T system would result in the loss of 8 stations at a time. After the short was cleared and things cooled off, the ports would come back up.

I haven't seen a shorted second pair on the TD systems knock out a block of extensions, but I suppose anything is possible.
I've seen a dead short on data pair knock down all 8 ports on a internal card before

#155365 03/14/06 07:11 PM
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Joe - the damaged port is not on one of the 2 add-on 8-EXT boards (ports 17-32) it is on one of the main system ports (#15). Would this not require replacement / repair of the entire main system board / chassis?

#155366 03/15/06 12:39 AM
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if you take the cover off the internal cards have at least 4 screws and a ribbon cable on each

#155367 03/15/06 12:58 AM
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I would 1st try a different Amp. cable, one with a blunt end not terminated and tie down the yellow/slate to a buscuit jack and then see if port 15 comes up. Also make sure port 15 is not assigned as a voicemail port in field 117.
MrG

#155368 03/15/06 02:03 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by ev607797:
Panasonic systems have always been really sensitive to shorts, even on the analog systems. A short on an analog KX-T system would result in the loss of 8 stations at a time. After the short was cleared and things cooled off, the ports would come back up.

I learned this the hard way on my first KX-T624, I lost all 8 ports to a short and replaced the whole system. I pluged it in about a month later while I was cleaning things out and it works fine.


I Swear I did not touch anything bash
#155369 03/15/06 03:46 AM
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So I am just looking at options here.. even with this dead port aside, we are out of ports anyway and need some expansion, and have already added the max. 2 8-EXT cards. So our only options would be to replace it completely with something else, or to pair it with a second cabinet, right?

This system is as follows;
KX-TD1232, date code 93-12, ROM P101E60905A, purchased by us about Oct. 97.
based on the ROM I'd guess it's a -1 unit. Perhaps somebody can help confirm that? how can I positively identify what dash I have?

question: can a -1 be paired with a newer unit, ie a -7, and if so could the -7 be the master and would you gain the additional features of the higher rev unit on some or all ext's?

looking at this;
https://www.ablecomm.com/panphonsysve.html
the words "Increased processing speed, circuit board modifications" under the description for dash 2 concern me that there might be problems with compatibility between pre and post -2 units?

Thanks

#155370 03/15/06 04:29 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by Jason M:
Joe - the damaged port is not on one of the 2 add-on 8-EXT boards (ports 17-32) it is on one of the main system ports (#15). Would this not require replacement / repair of the entire main system board / chassis?
There are (2) 8 port station boards *inside* the cabinet. If you are handy with a phillips head screwdriver, you can replace them.

P101E is a "Dash -1". You will _absolutely_ require another Dash-1 if you want to expand.

-Joe
www.austintele.com
775 888 9292

#155371 03/15/06 05:21 AM
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can the -1 be upgraded at all, new EPROM's or whatever? (doubt it based on what I've read, but worth asking..)

worst case, I *could* get two -7's (or dash-something-newer) to replace this one completely.. if I did this, would my existing 8-EXT cards be compatible?

a somewhat related question; the newer units support ISDN PRI service. Can the PRI card use BRI service as well? Can it use multiple BRI services? ie. if we had need for 6 lines equiv. that would be 3 BRI's, a PRI would be a waste. Could it be done?

Joe - are these 'internal' station board the same boards as the add-on '8-EXT' station boards?

#155372 03/15/06 06:05 AM
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The -1 KX-TD version has the eproms soldered in. The unit would have to be sent in to the factory to be upgraded with a socket and the appropriate software.


Ed Vaughn, MBSWWYPBX
#155373 03/15/06 06:29 AM
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This unit has the ROMS socketed already.

It also has a number of 7433 phones on the system. the feature list I read said that the 7400 series wasn't supported until the -3. so I don't know what I have..

Is there any actual way to tell what is really in there right now?

#155374 03/15/06 07:21 AM
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Sounds like your KSU has already been upgraded but the label on it wasn't changed. We will have to wait for Mr. Gemini to chime in on how to check the software version because I have forgotten and someone has my manuals out right now.


Ed Vaughn, MBSWWYPBX
#155375 03/15/06 10:13 AM
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if its got 7400's on it and they function
it's at least a -3

#155376 03/15/06 11:09 AM
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Jason M Offline OP
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I have a 7433 on my desk right here.. works fine..

but the ROMs are P101E60905A

wassup with that?!

#155377 03/15/06 12:32 PM
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The 7400 series phones are designed to be on a Ver. 3 or higher.
The P101EA is a Ver1. You really can't do anything with it.
The chips should have sockets but the Ver 2 went to a 12 mhz CPU.
Dual cab. systems must be the same version.
You can upgrade to a TDA, (50 or 200) and keep all the phones. If you only need 1 more port for now I would do as Joe recommended and change the card.
You can send it in and get upgrade to a 6 but they would have to change everything.
All the cards are compatable.
Did you verify that port is not assigned as a voice mail port and did you put a different amp. cable on it and the check just that port?
MrG

#155378 03/15/06 12:56 PM
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Our vendor, who sold us the 1232, sold us the 7433 phones as well. I would have hoped they would have sold us properly compatible hardware, but hey - I was never impressed with them, that's why I do all the work myself now!

So if I really want to know, I can check the speed of my processor - if its 12MHz, it must be a v2 or above board.

I was talking to CountyWide about the TDA systems today, they sound like our best bet so far.. the 1 fried port is just the latest blow, we have been maxed out on digital ports for quite a while, and have been adding SLT's instead (20 now) so we really do need a system upgrade of some kind anyway, not just the 1 port. We've just been putting if off because we've been talking about moving to a new building so that would be the time to get a new phone system too.

I checked the port is not a VM port. but I don't have another cable available to check that, besides none of that side of the BIX block was touched.

ty

#155379 03/15/06 04:03 PM
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It is a Ver-1 by the string you posted.
Is this off the chips or through program 116? :shrug:
Regardles whether the bix was touched there could always be a problem in the field or just a bad Amp. connector.
I suppose you could disconnect it and put the other one on it and see if the original Ext. 107 is dead or did it turn into Ext. 115 :idea:
MrG

#155380 03/15/06 06:42 PM
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the rom version I posted is from the management software.

#155381 03/17/06 05:43 PM
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I had a problem similar to yours a few weeks ago, the phone gave a clicking sound when plugged in and leds acting bizarre, same system, same P101 software (had to use a DOS software to program, it's on another post) but anyway, measured the output voltages on the station port, found it to be the same as the rest of the ports. I looked at the programming and found that the port had been setup as a DSS. changed it back to a station and the phone worked. thought that I would pass it along.
Tj

#155382 03/20/06 10:34 AM
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that sounds like someone was in there b4
you with the russian software

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