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Posted By: mgere MP3 player - 11/11/08 12:02 PM
I need a MP3 player that can be powered by plugging into a wall outlet or powered by USB.
All I need is 512 or 1G, does anyone have any models I can look at?
Posted By: MacGyver Re: MP3 player - 11/11/08 01:17 PM
Best Buy has a load of cheap ones that fit your application. I bought one for one of the kids a couple of weeks ago for less than the cost of dinner. It didn't come with an AC adapter, but AC-USB adapters are readily available.
Posted By: OCI Re: MP3 player - 11/14/08 05:15 AM
Assume you want an MP3 for message-on-hold, not personal use. We have installed many of these units with no problems. Check them out.

https://www.nel-techlabs.com/messager_mp3.html
Posted By: Bolts Upright Re: MP3 player - 11/14/08 06:29 AM
Let the buyer beware. And, I hope I'm not too far off topic... You get what you pay for. I bought a couple of those low priced MP3 players and had nothing but trouble. Not saying there are not players out there in the 20 to 30 dollar ballpark, just that I had trouble with them and got tired of taking them back to the store. I ended up getting a SONY Walkman, an exquisite little machine. It was $90 but well worth it.
Posted By: MacGyver Re: MP3 player - 11/14/08 07:39 AM
So far we've had very little trouble with mp3 players. Our biggest issue in the past was having a source that would come back up automatically after a power failure. Since all of our locations now have dedicated workstations hooked to the phone switch for programming, we just have a playlist in the start up menu and allow the media player on the computer to supply the hold music.
Posted By: CMDL_GUY Re: MP3 player - 11/14/08 12:27 PM
Because a post in this thread makes reference to using an MP3 player for the purpose MOH I would like to point out the following:
In accordance with US copyright laws, a license may be required from the American Society of Composers, Authors and Publishers (ASCAP) or other similar organizations if copyright music is transmitted through the music/message on hold feature/devise.
Posted By: Tom N Re: MP3 player - 11/17/08 01:57 PM
Quote
Originally posted by CMDL_GUY:
Because a post in this thread makes reference to using an MP3 player for the purpose MOH I would like to point out the following:
In accordance with US copyright laws, a license may be required from the American Society of Composers, Authors and Publishers (ASCAP) or other similar organizations if copyright music is transmitted through the music/message on hold feature/devise.
Yup I just finished building a Pretty good size MOH Network at a few of our hospitals for Dr's Offices. Had to pull the radios out and Install payed for MOH boxes with amps
Posted By: RRino Re: MP3 player - 11/17/08 02:19 PM
Buyer beware is right. There are alot of junk mp3 players out there so choose wisely. You can get an IPOD Shuffle for around 50 bucks these days.
Posted By: MOH Derek Re: MP3 player - 11/19/08 03:06 PM
Quote
Originally posted by CMDL_GUY:
Because a post in this thread makes reference to using an MP3 player for the purpose MOH I would like to point out the following:
In accordance with US copyright laws, a license may be required from the American Society of Composers, Authors and Publishers (ASCAP) or other similar organizations if copyright music is transmitted through the music/message on hold feature/devise.
To validate what CMDL_GUY posted, you cannot play music on-hold that you own on an MP3 player, CD player, computer, etc. unless you have paid the proper licensing fees. You are not even allowed to play the radio on-hold as it falls into the same category. It is considered a "public performance" and ASCAP and BMI can certainly try to claim the the fees and penalties for the artist if aware.
Posted By: Lightning horse Re: MP3 player - 11/19/08 03:15 PM
I thought the off-the-air MOH arguement had been finished off in court. Theory was that those on hold would be able to listen to it on their radio anyway, so no biggie. John C.
Posted By: MOH Derek Re: MP3 player - 11/19/08 03:33 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Lightninghorse:
I thought the off-the-air MOH arguement had been finished off in court. Theory was that those on hold would be able to listen to it on their radio anyway, so no biggie. John C.
John, this is a FAQ from the ASCAP website. There is plenty of license free music out there, so you are right, it may not be a biggie.

10. I want to use music-on-hold in my business. Do I need permission?

Yes. When you place a caller on hold and transmit music via your telephone lines, that is a public performance of the music. It is your responsibility to obtain permission to perform ASCAP songs from ASCAP or directly from the copyright owner. ASCAP represents tens of thousands of copyright owners and millions of songs and an ASCAP license will give you the right to perform them all.
Posted By: hbiss Re: MP3 player - 11/19/08 07:10 PM
Theory was that those on hold would be able to listen to it on their radio anyway, so no biggie.

John, I think that theory would hold for any use of radio, CDs, internet music, etc. in a business- if it were true. Unfortunately it is not and it is a biggie. That quote from ASCAP tells it like it is.

With few exceptions, no radio, no CDs, no internet music, etc. is allowed unless you pay the royalties and they must be paid to all three- BMI, ASCAP and SESAC.

An easier way is to use royalty free music, a custom production or a service such as Muzak, DMX, or a business XM or Sirius account that includes the royalty payments as part of the cost.

-Hal
Posted By: RRino Re: MP3 player - 11/20/08 07:19 AM
All legal mumbo jumbo aside, how many of your customers have just a radio or a CD player for their MOH? We encourage our customers to get some sort of professional MOH production and include that into the sale, but, you know how some people are. "We just had this radio running for our old system, why should we spend more money, blah, blah, blah." If these organizations really wanted to enforce these royalties, they would have a big job on their hands.
Posted By: Lightning horse Re: MP3 player - 11/20/08 02:58 PM
Travis, I came from a small city in central KS, and ASCAP 'came to town' and was harrassing everybody. They were pretty much ignored and they gave up. But, for those of you that are really worried about it, Home on the Range and Greensleeves are in the public domain. And you can tell your Greensleeves users that the system knows when Christmas happens, and plays 'What Child Is This' during the month of December. (Same Melody) smile John C.
Posted By: hbiss Re: MP3 player - 11/20/08 04:05 PM
If these organizations really wanted to enforce these royalties...

They do and have been since the successful music sharing and downloading busts by Sony. Once they identify you, ASCAP, BMI or SESAC won't take legal action unless you refuse to either cease and desist or comply. I seriously doubt they were ignored, more likely the perps just changed their tune (no pun intended).

-Hal
Posted By: KLD Re: MP3 player - 11/20/08 05:49 PM
Originally posted by hbiss:

Once they identify you, ASCAP, BMI or SESAC won't take legal action unless you refuse to either cease and desist or comply.


A local CW resturant/bar had a local group playing CW, Blue Grass, Country Rock on Friday nights....ASCAP saw the advertisement for them, notified them to cease or they'd sue, they also threatened the bar owner....so they quit. A lot of the songs are older than this country. Ain't it a crock?
Posted By: CnGRacin Re: MP3 player - 11/21/08 07:28 AM
Quote
Originally posted by KLD:
Originally posted by hbiss:

Once they identify you, ASCAP, BMI or SESAC won't take legal action unless you refuse to either cease and desist or comply.


A local CW resturant/bar had a local group playing CW, Blue Grass, Country Rock on Friday nights....ASCAP saw the advertisement for them, notified them to cease or they'd sue, they also threatened the bar owner....so they quit. A lot of the songs are older than this country. Ain't it a crock?
Ken,
Is there more to this story? ... I thought it was all good for "cover bands" to play live music as long it wasn't recorded for re-sale. :shrug:
Posted By: CnGRacin Re: MP3 player - 11/21/08 07:35 AM
We had a conversation in the booth not all that long ago on my feelings with copywrite infringement and my pretty hard-line feelings on musicians and composers NEEDING to be paid for their work… I’m glad there are organizations like ASCAP out there. But that being said, I’m really puzzled why anyone would have a problem with off-air broadcast from radio stations could not be used for MOH. It’s already being transmitted out in the air for free use. Crap like that can burn people on a good cause. mad
Posted By: mgere Re: MP3 player - 11/21/08 07:53 AM
I bought the Sandisk Sansa Clip 1G MP3 player, just waiting for it to come in. I will post how well it works, it didn't come with a power adaptor, but we have a spare blackberry charger that will do the trick. I think the biggest thing is to find one that plays when being plugged in to external power.
It's true that you get what you pay for, this one cost $30 bucks, so we will see.
Posted By: hbiss Re: MP3 player - 11/21/08 08:58 AM
I’m really puzzled why anyone would have a problem with off-air broadcast from radio stations could not be used for MOH.

Probably because the business gets to choose the station their customers get to listen to. The callers are a captive audiance (for what it's worth) to what the business thinks makes it look good and you don't hang up. So in reality the business is using it enhance their business.

This is the reasoning behind juke box royalties costing less. The patrons or customers get to choose what they want to listen to. If the establishment has a music system the owner chooses what the patrons listen to and that costs more because it is assumed that the music will be selected specifically to enhance the atmosphere of the business.

A local CW resturant/bar had a local group playing CW, Blue Grass, Country Rock on Friday nights....ASCAP saw the advertisement for them, notified them to cease or they'd sue, they also threatened the bar owner... so they quit.

Live performances also require royalty payments unless the performers restrict themselves to music that is in public domain or they play their own original stuff. Just because something is old doesn't mean that it is in the public domain. The original composer may be long gone but their heirs may have arranged to continue receiving royalties for each performance.

Normally it is the establishment that pays the royalties directly to BMI, ASCAP and SESAC and that covers all performances they book. It's not a lot of money and that is why you often see the BMI, ASCAP and SESAC stickers on the front doors. I guess some people want to be a hard ass and stupid, but if you run a legitimate business, like insurance it's just another business expense.

If you have any questions just go the one of the websites- BMI and ASCAP are both very informative with FAQs for anything you want to know on the subject.

-Hal
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