I'm hoping someone here can help guide me in the right direction. My phone jacks went dead in my house over the weekend (which also leaves my DSL internet dead). Phone company said service is good to the house, so I'm left to chase down the problem. I'm wondering if my old Siemens S66M1-50 could have "gone bad." It doesn't seem like there is anything in a device like that to go bad, but I have no experience.

More background if you want it:
House is 4 years old. I wired it for electricity, phone, and ethernet myself (but I'm no expert). I used CAT 5 for phone, knowing it's overkill but better than CAT 3 and I had it on hand. I had an old 66 block someone gave to me. Never used one before, but concept seemed simple enough for one-time use for phone wiring my house.

So... trying to get to the point, the service IS good into the house. If I hook up a phone to the line from the phone company, it works. But after 4 years of working perfectly, now no phone jack will work in the house if wired from the 66 block. I have phone company line wired to rows 1 & 2, column 4. Other phone jacks wired down column 4. I use one pair pulled from a spare CAT 5 piece to loop from rows 1 & 2, column 3 to column 3 of the other connected rows. I've changed wires, etc. Narrowed it down (seemingly) to the point where the 66 block would appear to be bad. Again... is that possible? We do get lots of lightning around here, but I don't know if that's relevant or not.

I guess a new 66 block wouldn't be very expensive, but it just seems weird that something so simple (no moving parts or computer chips) would suddenly stop working.

Puzzled,
Shawn

Troubleshooting 101, isolate the feed in, is there dial tone? Reconnect each jack one at a time. Check each outlet one at a time.

Ive seen 66 block problems when double punched wires spread the pins so they no longer properly grip the wire

With DC voltage and dampness I've seen connections turn green with corrosion due to electrolysis. I have also seen severe corrosion when pool chemicals were stored in the same room.

I'd start by checking the jacks 1st, myself. Most likely point of problem. Problems with the block are really rare.

If all the jacks went bad at once and there is DT at the NID then the 66 block as the point of distribution would be the place to start .

If it was an old block to start with, it's possible that the spring tension in the clips has loosened. Give the clips a little squeeze with a pair of long nose pliers.

If that doesn't work then start troubleshooting.

Sam

I think your service provider probably said "to the house" instead of "into the house".

There must be some type of cable between the service provider delivery point (usually on side of house) and where you have your 66 block located.

If you use a cell phone and dial your own number you should get rings but not a busy signal. If yes then ground together those two pins you consider to be the incoming CO line and dial again. You should get busy signal.

This test should tell you if your line is good INTO the house!

Not necessarily. All is takes is one bad jack to short the pair, thus putting the others Out of Service as well. Happens here all the time with corrosion on the needle pins of the jack being corroded.

To answer your question directly, no, there is nothing in a block to go bad. I would start with a visual inspection looking for broken wires at the clips. Wiggle all of them around and look for any movement at the clips. As mentioned, any corrosion or that sort of thing indicates that the block needs to be replaced. But again, my experience has been that problems like this are caused by wires broken off at the clips. Done it myself many times.

What did you use to punch the wires onto the clips?

-Hal

How did you terminate them when you installed the 66 Block? Did you use the proper tool? Or did you use a screw driver, knife etc.? Also by the way your profile shows you are located in the USA. Just exactly in the USA?

Mike

When I got of the boat & first saw a 66 block i thought wtf, looked like something designed by the flintstones......Most developed countries use Krone..............with Krone there's not the temptation for the user/company who doesnt want to pay for a Tech to do their on DIY connection with 2inches of bare wire and a screw driver.

Well if both your DSL and your phones are out the trouble is before the splitter so that's where I'd start. That is assuming it's a splitter instead of filters at each phone.

I've seen lines killed inside the house by something as simple as a vacuum cleaner damaging the cord from the jack to the handset.

Troubleshooting 101 like johnp says. Unplug everything. Go to 66 block. DT or NDT?? DT--plug one device in--NDT --go to each jack and take wires off of the jacks. Keep going---step by step. Slow.

I've had customers kids put crap in an unused jack--shorted out all of the lines. I've had a fork coming out of a jack one time. Goofy.

Troubleshooting 101.

Agreed 100%

Unplug all phones and check for dailtone on the 66 block.

If no dialtone, pull all of your cross connects and check for dialtone.

If there is dialtone, reconnect each jack one at a time, checking for dialtone after each connection. This will point you towards a bad jack/shorted cable pair.

If there is still no dialtone, your feed to the demarc is bad.

D

Do you have a central station alarm system in the house?

That would be the first thing to suspect. With myself and all my friends and relations we don't have enough fingers and toes to count how many times Telco has been incorrect by trouble-shooting from a computer five states away.

Dean

Wow. And I thought folks were good about helping people on computer-related forums. I didn't expect so many helpful responses to my question. I couldn't help but think most people would pass on by rolling their eyes thinking "what a doofus."

It helps to know that it's very unlikely for a 66 block to "go bad." Agrees with my logical assumptions, although limited experience.

The whole thing started with buzzing on lines, then no dial tone. First thing I did was pull the "distribution line" (I call it) off one jack at a time on the 66 block, each time checking with my cordless phone. I got to one that, after pulling off, gave me clear DT on cordless. Thought my problems were done (knowing I'd have to look at that jack... later). Then found out the jack my DSL was on was dead. Then the rest of the story.

So... now that I know that 66 blocks rarely go bad (I don't have pool chemicals in the mech room and I don't have an alarm system), I will redouble my efforts in checking/remaking the connections on the block.

One of you may have hit the nail on the head. I had an old punchdown tool. I'm inexperienced and hadn't slept much the night before, so I was using the wrong tip. I was using the notched tip you'd use to put wires into a female wall outlet do-hicky (for ethernet), not the one that surrounds the 66 block terminal point. The wires looked squeezed down between the metal points but the wrong tool probably isn't providing reliable results. I'll look to see if there the right tip inside the handle of that thing and start rechecking all connections.

I have verified that the line from the phone company is good all the way into the mechanical room to the point where I'd punch it into the block.

Thanks everybody for your replies and patience with a guy that is not an expert. Maybe part of my bday present (to myself) today will be that I fix the darn phone service in the house.

--Shawn

You're not a dufus at all. A dufus is one who drives around naked , but that's another story.

If the 66-block proves to be trouble for you, I don't see why you couldn't replace it with a barrier terminal block . They're readily available from Home Depot type stores and don't require special tools. They also provide a great way to tie multiple pairs together, which at some point can get tricky with a 66-block.

For no brainer and no tool type terminations I like the Amp series commoning blocks. example here.

In your testing... Had you pulled the ADSL signal off and not punched it back down to that jack? (Obvious but I have to ask ya know.)... Or if you DID punch it back down, did you not get it re-terminated properly when putting it back? (Did you creat a NEW problem, different from your noisy/bad jack.)


I know the other esteemed collegues here have mentioned it’s VERY rare for a 66-block to go bad... But I’m going to beg to differ since you’ve now mentioned you’ve been beating on that one with the OTHER DO-HICKY LOL… We’d call it a 110 blade just-so’s ya know.


Happy Birthday to you too Shawn and good luck.
:toast:

Yeah, using a 110 blade on a 66 block is no better than using a butter knife. You spread the clips so now they won't squeeze the wire properly. So now I would suggest changing the block because you damaged it.

-Hal

Spuds, I'm in Missouri.

CnGRacin, yep, that's what I think happened. Originally I pulled off one by one to find the offending line. ADSL line was pulled, but was not the offending line, so I kept going. Next one I pulled was the offending line, so I left it off (no time to fix at the time so planned to mess with that one later). Leaving the bad one disconnected, I went back and reconnected the ones previous that were ok... problem was I used the wrong do-hicky, aka "the 110 blade" to reconnect them. That's when I got all confused and things went downhill from there.

hbiss, I'm hoping there's a little life left in the 66 block. Maybe it will help that I'm using CAT 5 for POTS since it is thicker than CAT 3 (& therefore will be easier to grip between the clips that I mistakenly spread with the 110 blade). I guess a new 66 block wouldn't cost much, but I hope to make do with this if possible. I've used the proper tip to punch down the source and connect two jacks. So far, so good.

Also, I never knew about the bridging clips or their function (I never had any). If I had purchased & used those, this whole ordeal would've been so much easier to troubleshoot by simply pulling & replacing clips to test each line instead of pulling the connecting wire and punching back down. I'm going to grab some bridging clips this time and see if I can squeeze a bit more service out of this 66 block.

You all have been very helpful. Thanks a lot for being willing to help a guy who is out of his area of expertise.

CnGRacin, thanks for the birthday wish.

Shawn

hbiss, I'm hoping there's a little life left in the 66 block.
:nono:

Get a new one, they are inexpensive.

Just thought I'd let everyone know... I bought a bag of bridge clips, used a fresh pair from a CAT 5 piece, and rewired the old block using bridge clips this time. The offending jack that started everything in the first place is still grounding out--I'll check it someday in the future when all the boxes are moved out from that corner. All else works like a charm. Gosh, those bridge clips are great. If I'd have been using those in the first place, none of this other trouble would've happened. I wouldn't have needed the tool (and wouldn't have used the wrong tip) in the first place because I could've just pulled the clip off that bad circuit.

Anyway, thanks to everybody again for helping. And I know a new block would've been cheap. If I had been a professional doing work for a customer I'd have just put in a new one to be totally sure, but I figure why generate trash if this one would still work. It seems I didn't ruin the terminals even after using a 110 blade.

Thanks!

Shawn

Well Shawn, you are very expressive. I like that. I don't know what your strengths are, but you're welcome to come hang with us.

You can't imagine how laughable, yet how humbling it sounds to me to hear someone go on about bridge clips. It reminds me of how young I once was and how it is now that I have a responsibility to "hook up" the noob as someone once did me.

I like your attitude. There are far too many clowns that come into our forum who either post, "well that's what I first thought" (which is clearly bullshit, otherwise they wouldn't have posted) or the hubris of [what we call] a CG, or Computer Guy. The Computer Guy tends to be our arch enemy as he seems to know everything...just ask him!

Please stay a while. And even if you don't know much about voice stuff, we have many other forums where you might be able to provide help.

Welcome to the Sundance board.

like Tim said , Shawn

another thing you can try is to use the pins you didn't stretch out with the 110 blade

tell me about it, as a kid we always were treated to a visit from bell the day mom would strip wallpaper. Those old copper jacks corroded in no time. Bell got smart in the 90s, before getting out of the inside wire business they started installing aluminum jacks