Hello brain trust,

I have a 2565 HKM key set which dials fine on the copper landline. And when it gets to a numeric menu system at a company, it also behaves correctly.

BUT it seems that (at times) when I am using the MagicJack line and it gets to a menu system, the menu system does not respond to the touch tones at all. It's as if they are not received at all on the other end. When this issue occurs, my workaround is to pick up that line with the cordless phone to dial the menu choices.

At least things started out that way when I first noticed it. Now it seems that the phone is starting to misdial phone numbers also when using the MagicJack line. No issues at all on the AT&T copper, either dialing a number or on a menu system.

I'm scratching my head over this and I'm hoping someone here knows why it's going on and if there is a way to keep using the 2565 on the MagicJack.

Thanks!

Bob Goodman

My thoughts...

Business telephone systems such as the 1A2 and Avaya Partner & Merlin platforms were designed when Bell System RBOCS were the only source of telephone service. As such, they adhere tightly to standards set by Belcore. Consumer grade products tend to tolerate a wider range of conditions.

For example, a Partner or Merlin system often have trouble displaying Caller ID when connected to a VoIP based service, but, work perfectly fine when connected to POTS line service provided by the RBOC.

I would suggest contacting magicJack customer service and see what, if anything they can do.

Magic Jack and a lot of other dial tone 'gadgets' don't generate the voltage and loop current required. Most 1A2 hardware was designed and built around working behind real central offices, not these substitutes. A 2565 is no different from a 2500 set electrically, but it still requires 48 volts on the line to function within specs. since the dial receives its power directly from the CO line. Last I checked, the Magic Jack device only provides a loop voltage somewhere in the 12 volt range. Cordless phones or systems that require external power to function are able to function better in these low voltage conditions since the tones being sent are generated internally, and not dependent upon loop voltage to operate.

All hope is not lost, however. There are some loop line extenders that will condition the line so that it delivers the proper voltage and loop current characteristics.

CLICK HERE TO SEE AN EXAMPLE OF ONE

I've had this issue with voip devices. You can try cleaning the contacts around the sides and on the back of the dial. Just use a non-glossy business card, put it between the contacts and hold a button down to activate the contacts. Then drag the business card around a little. It certainly can't hurt anything. I've had a few with the same issue, works on copper, hit and miss on voip, and the only solution was to re-tune or replace the dial. Try cleaning it first. If that doesn't help, you're looking at re-tuning or replacing the dial. I've had about a 50% success rate re-tuning dials. Most of the time the slugs are stuck and won't turn. Usually all it takes is a tiny tweak to get it working again. Before you attempt this and risk making the dial completely useless, make sure it's not an issue of the magic jack not providing enough current to actually power the dial. This might be hard to test... One other thing you can do, pick up the suspect phone and a known working phone on the same line (use your copper line for this) and dial your magic jack number or your cell phone or something else you can answer and get a quiet line. Compare the sounds from the known good dial to the suspect dial. You should especially be able to notice a problem when you beat the tones together. If they are the same, all you'll hear is the tone, if one is out, you'll hear the warble of it going in and out of phase. I suspect it's only out a few hertz. Copper lines are a bit more tolerant than the voip adapters usually are. If you were using an unlocked adapter (magic jack uses locked adapters) you could probably set the tone detection a little looser and it would probably be fine.

Dials are around to be had. Unfortunately the 2565's have extra leads for the speakerphone, so the dials are a little rarer. I have a box of TT pads somewhere, but I'm pretty sure they aren't speakerphone compatible. I'll look in the next few days and see if I have one.

Hi Ed. That sounds hopeful. Pricey little gadget though. Are there any other brands or alternatives to the Viking version? Anyone have a used one?

Hey Ed, doesn't my 1A2 KSU power supply provide me with all the current I need on the line? I don't need the phone to ring because I don't take incoming calls from the MagicJack. But the KSU has the various voltages for talk/dial. Am I confused?

No, the power supply only provides voltages for lamps, controls and intercoms. The lines themselves pass straight through the line card to the phone. Yes, the Viking unit isn't cheap, but it was designed specifically for this issue.

Mike Sandman's site has more gadgets to address this issue, but they aren't cheap either.

HERE'S SANDMAN'S PAGE

OK, ordered the Viking: https://www.vikingelectronics.com/products/tbb-1b/. We'll see how it works. Thanks!

You know, this could also be a network issue. MagicJack is VoIP based. There are different ways that DTMF signalling is transported over IP. RFC2833 is the typical standard for DTMF over RTP (Real Time Protocol). But, you can also send DTMF inband. If there is a mismatch between the caller and the far end, this can cause the DTMF to not get through to the other side. I've found that typically, DTMF is received at the user's device end, filtered out of the audio, and regenerated by the terminating device.

But, I really think the loop current is your issue, like the others have explained above.

Weirder and weirder.

I received the Viking Talk Battery Booster TBB-1B and installed it in the MagicJack line. But I did not plug its transformer into AC. So it's in the line but not powered at all.

Now I call a company where my 2565 desk set consistently fails to activate their menu system with the MagicJack. But now, the keys work and the menu responds. I take the Viking out of the line, call back, and the menu does not respond. Put the Viking back in (again, with no power) and now the menu does respond.

So the theory that the 2565 does not have enough line power to work the dial properly is now called into question. Especially since I have not added any juice to the line.

Would love to figure why this is working with no added electrons.

Are you sure you have it connected properly? I can't see how your phone works at all without the unit powered.

As to your question, without taking actual voltage and current readings on you phone's T&R both with the TBB connected in the line and not connected and again connected with the unit powered I have no idea what's going on. Maybe someone at Viking tech support can answer that. I didn't design it.

All the advice given here ASSUMES that the loop voltage and current is low. So you go out and spend money on a TBB and now you call that into question. A proper diagnoses should be done first to determine what the situation is then decide what to do about it. Not just throw equipment at it by the seat of our pants.

-Hal

I'm sure that with voltage doubling circuitry, some amount of line voltage might be making something like this happen. I know that Viking offers their PS48RG power supply that takes a 12VAC input and outputs 96VAC ringing and 48VDC talk battery. With that said, Viking is no stranger to using this type of circuitry. I'm still at a loss as to how, but I agree that a call to their technical support people might be in order. If nothing else, I'm sure they'd like to know this.