OK, this is new since we upgraded the ACS from a 6 to a 7 when the 6 went to its maker. Everyone on this site said it started back in May when we installed a new 7 card.

I have 34Ds with 18 buttons programmed as "intercom *nn" where n is the extension in this case 10-33. That way they get an extension status at a glance and 1 button intercom calls throught he HFAI feature.

OK, if I pick up the handset and press an programmed extension button, then speak into the handset, then hang up - the extension that I just intercommed will start to ring with a call transfer distinctive ring. Also, when I push the programmed button the display reads "transfer: ext *mm" And it does this when no lines are on hold. And it will keep ringing and ringing and ringing until the remote extension forces a hangup.

Now if I just press the programmed button, say for ext 20, then go through the speaker without using the handset, all is fine. The remote extension does not ring.

It is only if the handset is used. This is a huge problem now because there recptionist answers all calls and uses the wireless mike and the handset lifter.

What is your ALS on those ext's?

I don't think it is a R.7 issue, but a all around programing issue.

Yes, when you pick up the handset you have a CO line. Pushing the programmed button transfers the call to that extension. Either hit the Intercom button after going offhook or push the programmed button and then pick up the handset.

Just to test, change automatic line selection to select intercom first. Then use the handset, I bet that it behaves the same way as on the speaker.

Ah yes, very good. I am sure ALS is set for whatever the default is for the R7. I know I was not able to bring any of the programming over to the new CPU and did it all manually. I'll play around with the ALS and see what happens.

I'd bet a nickel that you recently changed dial tone providers to a CLEC that used an IAD, or, your telco has stopped providing an open loop disconnect before the "receiver off hook" howler.

Yes, it is user error, when you lift the handset you auto line select an open dial tone, you press an auto intercom button and it does a transfer of that open line. BUT, since you never dial anything on that line, it times out, and is supposed to do an open loop to cause the Partner to disconnect before it goes to ROH. The IAD's can do Open Loop on Disconnect (if the distant party hangs up), but NOT on the ROH. Big problem if you do the same thing when checking voice mail, you'll lock up lines into the voice mail.

To test, put a dial tone on hold, and see it if disconnects automatically after 10 to 12 seconds. If not, set your ALS to Intercom first.

OK, at the same time as we upgraded the CPU they upgraded their Telepacific service. MPower merged with TP and they upgraded to a "dynamic t1" which gave them more channels for voice and data. That would ahve been May.

ALS, is that system-wide or per extesion? If we went intercom first, how would that impact the receptionist's CS10 wireles headset with lifter?

OK, if I pick up the handset and press an programmed extension button, then speak into the handset, then hang up - the extension that I just intercommed will start to ring with a call transfer distinctive ring. Also, when I push the programmed button the display reads "transfer: ext *mm"

Ummm, you sound like the people I train. Try pressing the DSS button FIRST then picking up the handset.

When you pick up the handset first you pick up an idle line. Then you press the DSS button which puts it on hold. When you replace the handset the line with dialtone gets transferred to the extension you were just talking to.

The receptionists extension has to be set to immediate ring for the headset to be able to pick up a ringing line otherwise it will select an idle line and behave as above.

If you had purchased from a local dealer they would have told you this.

-Hal

Well, yes, TelePacific is the source of the new behaviour. Human nature being what it is, you're never going to get people to stop and think about pushing the auto intercom button before they lift the handset, so ALS is the best route to go.

ALS is programmed per extension, so you will need to do them all. Make it Intercom, then each line in the order they want them picked up, might be first to last, or last to first. When they want to make a call, if they lift the handset first, they can press 9, OR, press an open line. For those that dial on speakerphone, they can just hit an open line to turn on the speaker phone.

The Receptionist's headset with the lifter will still function properly on incoming calls, as the phone connects to whatever is ringing when you lift the handset.

Sorry to disagree but I don't see how the service provider has anything to do with this other than maybe CPC. The problem is user error as I explained above. True, changing ALS to intercom first will stop this from happening but every extension programmed that way will have to press an idle line button instead of just picking up the handset to make an outgoing call. So you just trade one problem for another.

The solution here is proper user training.

-Hal

The service provider has everything to do with the new behaviour of the phones. They do provide CPC on disconnect, but not on ROH. The Partner takes advantage of this function, instead of designing it to drop dial tone if a line is auto selected and then an auto intercom button is pressed without dialing anything on the dial tone. Even Comdial Executechs from 15 years ago did that! I've seen the issue come everytime a CLEC puts in an Adtran Total Access IAD, and training isn't going to change that.

Hal your right on as usual, here we usually refer to this type of problem as a "loose nut on the keyboard" test clear.
Any good dealer would have explained all of this in user training at time of install.
It's a very simple deal..

Tommy, you've lost me. :shrug:

By ROH I assume you are talking about what happens if you pick up an idle line and put it on hold. The CO should send a CPC type interruption in battery voltage after maybe 15 seconds to tell the system to disconnect. We have POTS lines here straight from the CO and Verizon stopped doing that many years ago. Put a line on hold and you can busy it out forever.

-Hal

SBC/at&t still provides an open loop before going from dial tone to the howler for "Receiver Off Hook" (ROH)

As much as you train people to lift the handset and press Intercom, or press the DSS button FIRST, 2 weeks later they will lift the handset, grabbing an open dial tone, and then pressing the DSS button. I watched a receptionist lift the handset, press Transfer, and dial an extension number.

When Call America, or TelePacific, or other CLEC converts them to a Flex T-1, with an IAD for dial tone and variable Internet bandwidth, they lose the ROH cutoff, and the fun begins.

Strange thing is the cable company here does provide the ROH cutoff and like the old NY TEL you won't have it until after about 15 seconds- and 15 seconds is a long time. Depending on how long the receptionist takes after lifting the handset and hanging up, it's still very possible that the line will get transfered. With ROH cutoff the extension will stop ringing after the 15 seconds have elapsed but it is still going to be annoying.

Dunno. I make it a point to explain that they have to press the page all, voice mail or DSS button first and I have never had a customer not understand it.

Maybe they're smarter here on the East coast. :rolleyes:

-Hal

AVAYA has forced 90 % of the old time techs out of this business.


That should relate to a stock option?


If they gamble on IP and all the newbie.

The result is who is singing the song?