sundance-communications.com/forum Forums Wiring - Telecom Carriers - Trunks & Services Cabling Telephones Systems Wiring Buried conduit packed with dirt...?

I have to run some fiber & Cat5 about 100'. I toned/traced the existing (buried) 3/4" conduit and one end has been packed with dirt. I'm not sure how far the dirt intrudes into the pipe. It seems I can get my fish tape in to about 5' from the end. So...worse case...5' of dirt.

Water from a hose? Compressed air? Any suggesstions are appreciated. I'm guessing water first to turn the dirt "muddy", then compressed air to blast it out.

:shrug:

If the dirt is all caked up, it may be a lost cause. I don't know about the water thing. If you've got 5' of dirt, then the water is only going to seep into the first few inches and then perhaps create a plug that is even worse. That may be what has happened at the far end.

Is the far end visible? Perhaps using a raw fish tape on a power drill like a powered sewer snake might poke through and break it up to allow you to then blow it out with air pressure. I'd round off the end of the tape though to avoid cutting the cable already in there. I assume there is existing cable in it?

Depending on how much $$ you want to spend on opening it up a sewer cleaning contractor with a jetter and or drain auger may be able to open it up.

If you want to try it yourself a pressure washer might work to open the plugged end up as it will have more force than just a hose.

Hmm...I like the auger idea. I'll try a small drain auger & shop-vac on the caked-up end. Worth a shot. I tried my steel fish tape, but it only seemed to compact the dirt even more.

Empty conduit. I can get to one end (Bldg. 1), but they cut it off below ground-level on the opposite end (Bldg. 2). That's where the dirt has intruded/settled over the years.

I would hook a hose up to the clear end however you can and turn the water on. Then go to the plugged end and start poking. If that doesn't work poke it with the drain auger. You can rent one for a few dollars, the kind with the electric drill powering it.

-Hal

How deep is the conduit and is it hard to access on the buried end? Is it hard to reach? May be easier to just dig up the plugged up 5' of conduit, cut it out, and splice on a new piece....that is if it is easy to get to. Sounds like you need to do some work on that plugged end anyways to get it into the building, so may be the easiest option.

I would use a shop vac and auger /fish tape or whatever else I could find to break the dirt up and work as mush of it out as possible I dont like the hose idea to start as it seems your just going to get mud

I would try to get a much dirt out and then maybe try to flush it with a hose

Try fishing the conduit from both ends and use lots of cabling grease. If your 5 feet away its probally stuck on the last 90 degree bend and cable grease should help. You might try compressed air from the clean end. if its blowing through its probally stuck on the 90 degree bend. You might try and use 2 fish tapes on one fish tape put some string with a few loops in it and the other fish tape make a hook and try and hook the string and use lots of grease.
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Those who say it can't be done?:db:Should not interrupt the people doing it! :db:

Please, please, hook up a camera. I can just imagine this one on funniest home videos! :db:

Did you try cutting off the tip of your tape and just have the raw end trying to poke through? It might weaken the clod just enough to blow it out with air pressure.

Hey Festec, We look like the Bobbsey twins here!

As business owners, installers and just plain jacks of all trades we like to think that we have the requisite skills to overcome just about any obstacle. The "case of the plugged pipe" has been presented and solutions provided.
Let me offer this:
Are you getting paid to clear the pipe even if not successful?
Does the customer have an electrical contractor on staff or contract for just such an event?
Is installing new pipe an option?
Is installing direct bury an option?
What's the best course of action and you still make money?

Please, please, hook up a camera. I can just imagine this one on funniest home videos!

Hey, I never said success didn't come without a few risks.

-Hal

Well...looks like the Minnesota farm boy showed the city-slicker once again how it's done... I used a small drain auger and pulled the dirt out little-by-little. Took awhile, but it worked. After I was done, I flushed with a hose from the "high end" to blow out any small rocks that might have been left behind. Thanks again for the assistance!

Here are pics of the layout to demonstrate the situation:

Conduit runs from Bldg. to Bldg. One end was identifiable, other end was buried.



Buried end (Bldg. 1) filled with dirt.



Dirt gone, box installed.



Conduit run the remaining distance to the demarc.



The canal behind the building. Anyone/everyone who saw me working back there had to remind me that an alligator lived in the canal and to be careful...one eye on my work, one eye on the canal.

My only other option was to dig a new trench and run new conduit. 120' through rocky, compacted soil (in 87 degree weather...with an alligator breathing down your neck) ain't my idea of fun. I'm using direct bury cable in the conduit. Direct bury by itself would have required a significant trench.

Electrical contractor? It's my job, why would I call an electrician? The only time I speak with electricians is to find out where the nearest liquor store or bar is.

This was one of those jobs that I didn't want, so I quoted an outrageous amount...outrageous enough to make the client balk (if you make an attorney swallow his gum, you know you're charging too much ). So yes, I am being compensated well for doing this, including digging out the dirt.

Well done!

-Hal

As Hal said " Well Done "

Cute. Well, if I drive about 20 miles, I might see a cow! :rofl: Sometimes we just get lucky but as professionals we just let the customer think we know exactly what we are doing!

Forgive me for typecasting, sorry. I just assumed that everyone from MN was raised on the farm! Thanks again for all your help. :toast:

I had a worse case of this a couple years ago. A conduit leading from a national chain restaurant to the reader board was filled with cement. Seems the pipe layer or, form maker made the cement form to hi, or the pipe to low. When the cement was pored guess where the cement went? you guessed it, right down the hole. I had driven three hours from Vancouver to wire and install all the Network equipment in the restaurant then, route the last two cables to the reader board.

My company called the PM for this chain to see what could be done. A plumber used a special heavy duty augur to remove concrete in a metal conduit.

The second time I went to do the cable install, the conduit was STILL not clear!! So, another 6 hours of driving wasted

Third try, the conduit was finally clear of cement and I routed and terminated the cable. Not sure who ate the 12 hours or round trip drive time but it sure was testing my patience.

Good job, Danny!

I am going to share a conduit experience that will "blow your mind".
Back in 68-69 time frame I was installing phones in a dept store. Keep in mind this was back in the day when it was common that jobs required the electrical contractor to provide a conduit for each phone.
Well, one of the conduits was stopped up about 75 feet into the run of a 150 foot conduit. I tried to force the fish tape but to no avail. I went to the electrician and told him his conduit was clogged. He poked around with it a few minutes and finally let loose with a few expletives. He then went to his truck and came back with a blasting cap and a roll of wire. He connected the blasting cap to the wire, taped it to the fish tape and inserted it into the conduit until it reached the blockage. He then set off the blasting cap and the blockage (pieces of concrete) came blowing out the other end. We then vacuumed the conduit to remove the residue and all was good.
When he inserted the blasting cap into the conduit I thought for sure we were going to have a blowout in the middle of the floor!

Bill

Hmmm, early version of the compressed air system?!

in '88 I had a conduit going from phone room to under concrete floor to center of room in new construction, BLOCKED. Fish tape both ways, fish tape with a hunk of doublejack chain to try to snag with tape from other end. No joy. Electrician brings in a compressed air bottle w/hose and adapter and sticks it on phone room end. His partner holds a piece of sheetrock over the floorbox 2-3 feet above floor. POOF, a load of concrete chunks, wood pieces, and assorted other garbage. Sparky said, "If you don't hold something over the box, there WILL be a flourescent fixture over the the box, and it WILL be damaged."

My experience comes courtesy of union sparkies sabotaging our conduit runs by stuffing rocks and soil down them.

-Hal

I heard if you cut the top off a can of expanding foam you can use a duct rod to push it in to the first bend.

And that would accomplish what? :shrug:

Must be a union guy.

-Hal

Yeah, the cap alone won't blow a hole in the floor,....... now if he had mixed a few bags of ammonium nitrate and a few gallon of diesel fuel to the mix.... You would proably need more than the floor fixed. LOL!

Conduit of yesteryear had the consistency of HY-80! Today's stuff is made out of Kia's and Yugo's!
Excellent pipe job, too...

Why is it that if theres a hole in something people with mixed concrete think they have to fill it?!

Hey, they just gotta hide/put that excess somewhere!

"Why is it that if there's a hole in something people with mixed concrete think they have to fill it?!"
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Never bend over in a concrete plant!

:thumb:

That's a good idea of using limited explosives to break concrete in a pipe apart. Just do not over due it or will put a whole in the ground