Are there any? 66/110 blocks or anything in that vein (NOT shielded patch panels)?

Not on this planet. If you were going to use STP you wouldn't be terminating it on blocks anyway.

-Hal

A hundred years ago I installed Tele Resources 32 PBXs. The single line stations used shielded quad for station cable. We would cut down the 4 wires and then the drain (10 cables on each side of a 66 M1-50). We would then cross connect the 2 pairs for each station and a single wire ground to each of the drains. This was all on standard 66 Blocks.

What application are you trying to address?

Sam

Thanx for the responses. Sam, was the site you mention prone to noise? I assume your solution worked?

This is for a for client who is thinking of taking an extra floor of a loft-type building that used to house a small printing plant on the ground floor and basements. All the wiring in the floor they occupy (directly above the departed printing plant) is shielded as far as I could tell from a rough inspection.
They want to move the equipment closet to a bigger one on the floor above. I'd just rather install xconnects in the old space and move the equipment to the new closet. I figure the cost of extra STP is roughly similar to laying new UTP wire everywhere.
One thing I don't feel comfortable doing is mix STP + UTP on the same run. Let me reiterate that noise seeping into the wire from the presses is no longer an issue. I've never seen shielded xconnects either, but I was hoping I'd missed something.

SPH -

That particular system was a very, very early computerized PBX. They were trying to keep foreign data/static/noise out of the system. It worked.

STP is prevalent in Europe. And it's our (America's) fault. One of the scenarios for Nuclear war calls for exploding a small nuclear device in the atmosphere above the enemy's territory, with the aim of disrupting communications.

We anticipated war with the USSR, with conflict beginning over the German Plains. When we rebuilt the West German Phone system after WWII we insisted that all wiring be shielded to protect communications from nuclear interference.

The idea of shielding comm wire became standardized across Europe.

If you don't have noise or RF - don't bother. I would think that it's probably overkill.

Most OSP cable coming in from the street is shielded. So you usually have shielded and non-shielded on the same run anyway. (A line would be shielded from the CO to the premise and then be unshielded inside the customers premise).

Sam

I agree with Sam. If there is not viable reason for the STP anymore, then make it UTP to the new communications room.

Curious... how many runs are you talking about? If it's not that many and not that far... you may want to read this thread on splicing : click here .

Thanks. Nice info re:STP Sam. If I may add, the threat of nuclear war was what brought the internet into existence too - it's a long story, but a fascinating one.
As for Telco OSP cable being shielded, don't they also install BET/disconnects that take care of the STP/UTP mix? (ie with integrated protectors, grounding/draining, etc on the CO side).
Tony, they need about 2 dozen outlets with 2-3 ports each. I doubt it's going to be more than 60 station runs total. I was trying for the option of faster turnaround if we only had to lay wire on the new floor. Now we're leaning towards just putting in UTP everywhere (if we get the job, that is).

SPH -

Re' the origins of the Internet in the Cold War.

When I worked for GTE I heard that story from some of the guys who developed the Internet. It was one night when I was snowed in in Chicago. We had been working on a "Data over the Voice Network" option for the GTD-4600 and were all trying to get home. We were drinking in a bar in O'Hare and wound up drinking all night till the skies cleared and the planes started flying again.

It was a great story and I'd be happy to share it - and hear yours too - But that'll have to be in another thread.

Or over a couple of drinks some time.

Sam

I worked at a radio station for a few years.. lots of shielded cabling, all on 66 blocks.. we used belden multipair solid individually shielded twisted pair for inter-studio snakes, and belden 8450 for jumpers. lots of heat shrink to dress the foil shields, and teflon tubing for drain wires.

lots of 25 pair utp for 1a2 as well, and a weco 711b SxS pbx..

I know I mentioned this in a thread long ago about punching down stranded wire on 66 blocks, probably on another board.

Anyway, some guy who claimed to have done sound work for TV studios such as where QVC originates also claimed to use 66 blocks to terminate the mic cables with no problems. We were talking about stranded wire and of course I disagreed with him as to that being punched down on the clips of a 66 block. But my point here is that I would not have a problem using them to terminate STP or UTP. They really aren't going to pick up any hum.

-Hal

Hal, I have made the mistake of trying to punch down stranded wire on 66 blocks more than a few times. It really does not work well. We did talk about it on this board at one time.

We commonly have MOH providers give us a stranded audio cable for MOH input, we'll either solder a small section of single-pair cross-cut or b-connect the cross-cut and then punch it down. Over time the stranded wires loose connection in the 66 clips, one wire at a time.

You CAN do it, but it doesn't mean it's correct. It's the same old "wrong tool, for the application".

we'll either solder a small section of single-pair cross-cut or b-connect the cross-cut and then punch it down.

That's the only reason we keep some beanies on the truck, to splice stranded to solid so it can be cut down on a block.

-Hal

I agree with beanies for stranded to solid connections... and being that we do a lot of Valcom bullhorns, they are the perfect product for the application (also for the MOH outputs).

Not to derail the thread too far, but do they make beanies that take inputs from both sides (like a butt-splice)? I've never even thought about looking for them, until we did these Valcom V-1422 .

I have some of the T&B 709 SC connectors. They take a full pair on both sides. You just close them with a pair of pliers.
https://www.newtechindustries.com/newtech/thomasandbetts/images/thomas1.jpg

Tony -

We used to use these tiny brass tubes for inline splices. No teeth inside and no insulation outside. We used to slide them on one side of a broken wire, twist on the other side, crimp them and tape them. They were designed for repairing breaks in the old, old residential wiring where replacing a run would be a nightmare.

When those were not available we would gently squeeze a beanie and pop open the closed end. Then insert the wires from opposite ends and crimp.

Both of these were emergency methods only as far as I was concerned, but I knew people who just left them in forever - or until they went bad again.

Sam

Sam, are these different than the copper caps used for ground wires? we used these to re-wire a bunch of stage lights that are high temperature. We used the caps as an inline splice and used heat shrink over it.

I have those and like them, but they aren't that good for stranded... they are better suited for in-line solid splices. Thanks though!


----

Sam, I have popped the end off a beanie to do what I'm referring to, but would rather have a product designed for it... instead of modifying something existing to work around it. It worked quite well as it turned out, I did a test piece first and stressed both ends, to see how easily it loosened... and it didn't.

Do you have a reference link for the "brass tubes" you refer to? They sound interesting, almost like a crimp on butt splice that I've used for car audio (although they came with the insulation on them).

Thanks!
----

If I could invent it, I would make a 110 punch, with a dust cover for the solid wire side and a set-screw terminal (or spade terminal and crimp-on spade connector), for the stranded side. All with heat shrink to fit.

If you do create it, credit me for the design!

Tony, PM sent...

Thanks for the varied info. As I suspected, xconnecting STP is too complicated for something as simple as this. Anyway, we haven't yet heard from the customer, so maybe they're getting cold feet.

ps Sam, yup, not many people realize that the impetus for the internet materialized when the Russkies (to use the terminology of the time) sent Sputnik up there, thereby proving that they possesed ICBM technology (and that the CIA got caught with its pants down yet again). Put the fear of God into these gummint types. Btw, I appreciate the offer, one of these days we'll probably arrange something.

Tony - Jeff -

Sorry I'm late responding to this, it's been a crazy week and I guess I just lost the thread.

Re' those little copper tubes:

Jeff - they are different from those copper caps.

Tony - There is no spec for those that I know of. They were ancient when I first saw them 40 years ago.

In the electrical world we use those insulated plastic tubes, but most of the ones I've used are for 12 AWG.

Sam

For the few times I needed them lately I just take a lug of any type but appropriate for the wire size and clip the ring or spade off and remove the plastic. I do know what you are talking about, they are uninsulated crimp splices. I used to use them also until my supply ran out. They have to be still made. Did you look at T&B? I believe those are the ones I had.

-Hal

Nicopress, Sam & Hal.

Excellent information....we used Nicopress sleeves with sleeve rollers to repair all types of open wire.

Thanks for the memories.

When I lived in Salina, KS we had a guy come in to see if we had any open-span line! An interconnect that began business in 1981! Oh well, I guess he figured phones is phones. Turns out he loved it for electric fence! Dug around and found out North Supply still had a part number! He was not interested when we told him price and quantity he would have to take. John C.

We use the sleeves and waxed string to fish walls.

Thanks Arthur. I used Hi-press stuff on the power when we built COs and Node sites but I always thought of it as for BIG electrical stuff. I guess the smallest I used it for was #6 AWG.

Sam

Interesting...I never knew Nicopress made electrical stuff, I have used their sleeves for aircraft cable when hanging speakers.

Right Arthur the small ones were for IW, the larger ones came in to different hole diameters, a smaller one for drop wire; and the larger one for iron(open) wire. It's been a long time ago HUH?