atcomsystems.ca/forum Forums Wiring - Telecom Carriers - Trunks & Services Telecom Service & Providers Dry DSL question

Had a service call today for a customer who got 'dry' DSL service from Verizon. They sent her a self-install kit, but nothing was working other than connectivity between the PC and the router that they sent.

I checked the jacks in the house and they were stone dead. No battery, no continuity, no meter kick whatsoever. Since there is no NID on the house, I have absolutely no idea where the wiring for the jacks actually goes (if anywhere).

According to Verizon, the service is live and ready to go. How this can be when there is obviously no drop to the house is beyond me. The house was completely gutted and rebuilt about two years ago and I'm guessing that the original 1972 drop wire was just cut off. Verizon's records may show that there is service to this address, but it clearly isn't.

I went out to the pedestal at the corner of her lot and found a 12 pair block with only four pairs appearing to be active. Two had dial tone for other neighbors and the other two just had battery on them. The rest were dead.

On a whim, I ran a temporary drop of IW and connected it to the first pair with battery. Nothing showed on the DSL modem, so I'm guessing that this pair is just connected to a non-programmed port in the local pair gain equipment. The fourth pair did cause the DSL light to come on, so I'm assuming that is (was) her pair, but there wasn't a drop pair connected to it. Despite the fact that the modem appears to like the signal that I gave it, it still wouldn't connect to the Internet. From what I can tell, this area is on clean F2 counts with no multiples, so I doubt that I've piggybacked onto someone else's circuit.

I've heard of dry DSL and worked with it in the past, but haven't ever explored exactly what I should be seeing at craft level since it is usually a no-brainer. The customer was given a virtual telephone number for the circuit, and it appears to be legitimate in the network because when it is called, an intercept recording informs me that this line is configured for outgoing calls only. The only thing that I can guess is that her DSL account is there and ready to go, but it hasn't been activated.

According to the instructions in the self-install kit, she should be able to connect to the Internet and log in to Verizon to activate her account, but it isn't possible.

Does anyone know if what I've seen is how it should be? I know that Verizon is going to have a cow when they find out that I placed a temporary drop from their pedestal. I only did this to prove them wrong since they have been convincing the customer for two weeks that she has a drop to her house. I don't even want to think about what might happen as a result of my actions, but I was just trying to help a customer who was at her wit's end. Verizon's 40 year-old records are obviously wrong (but through no fault of their own in this case), but getting them to do something about it sounds like it is going to be an uphill battle.

Here's where you develop amnesia. "Geeze, I looked in the box to see if you tagged a pair, and I didn't see one. Please come out and provide a demarc to the building like you're supposed to"

I've only seen about two dry DSL's and for the life of me, I can't remember if you can hear the carrier tone or not. I don't think you can.

So.....

Once you get on the correct pair at the brand new demarc, I guess you get to put in your username and password and call Vz.


Carl

Verizon has been stalling for two weeks just to try to avoid a truck roll... pathetic. Or should I say criminal. I would just remove the temporary drop and play dumb, when [if] Verizon ever actually sends out a tech to install a drop.

As far as battery on the pair, if a telco knows what they are doing, they would have battery even on "dry" DSL. Leaving the copper truly dry would allow it to rot on the poles, and we all know Verizon would never do that. Terminators are available for "dry" DSL that actually actually allow current to flow on the loop briefly [as in milliseconds] every 12 or 24 hours to condition the pair. These are usually installed in NID and require a truck roll, and if a telco cares about their copper they will use them. Again, we all know Verizon cares about what is left of their copper. Uh-huh.

Ed, you mentioned local pair-gain... If all they have in the customers neighborhood is concentrated lines, then there has to be a remote DSLAM for this customer. I have actually seen cases where a telco sells DSL to a customer in an area served by a SLC with no remote DSLAM anywhere in sight, and after jerking the customer around for weeks, they roll a truck and the tech has to explain to the customer that the sales office was wrong, and they can't get DSL at their house. That's some good quality customer service.

Jim
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Speaking from a secure undisclosed location.

I've worked on two, neither had battery on them. The only way to see the signal is with a DSL testset or putting a modem on it. I have read that some companies will put DT on them just to let the tech's know that it's a working pair. DT but no LEN.

I am a CO Tech for a company other than Verizon. On our "dry dsl" there is dial tone, and the line can be used for outgoing calls to x11 services only, (911 etc.). The line can also be used for incoming calls, mostly so that 911 could do a callback. On ours there is battery as required to provide the phone service. I can give you no help on how Verizon does things.

Thanks for that info. To me it makes more sense to put DT on it, lets the field tech know it's a working line. The x11 and incoming would be a nice feature, but most who use dry DSL get it because it's cheaper than cable and they use cell service for their phones.

Welcome to the board.

After a remodel I had a customer that had problems with their dry DSL line. No connectivity. (Except between the Modem and the PC)

I took the DSL modem to the demark and connected it to every pair on the 66 block one at a time until the DSL connected. Took about 3 minutes total.

The local Telco is REQUIRED by the FCC to install a NID,TNI, or demark as part of the installation. It is a FCC violation to not have a customer test point. I have taken our local telco to task many times on this subject. Your Public Utilities Commission can help you with this.

You won't get any battery and you should have some sort of circuit id just like any terminating circuit. The reason you have dry line dsl is because the LEC's lost in the class action lawsuit requiring you to have dial tone with their dsl service.

There are two versions of DSL that are referred to as "dry" in Verizon terminology.

The first one will show up with battery and ground but no dial tone. These are tested with a Colt 250 meter, although I'm sure you could test it with a JDSU if it's optioned for it.

The second version looks absolutely spare, no signs of life on it, no white noise, nothing. Nada. The more standard version is tested by the same meter. The old and complex one (sold at the time as "Verizon Gold DSL") which is a SHDSL circuit calls for a 250S meter - not the standard 250. No clue if anything else can be used to test these fairly rare birds...it's been a VERY long time since I've done one of them, and they haven't been offered for quite some time now.

The SHDSL was badged with an "ARDU xxxxxx" behind the code, the rest of them usually just come with a fictional phone number.

Hope this helps.