sundance-communications.com/forum Forums General General Telephone & Systems Information Western Union mach not answering

I got a strange one...

Customer has a PRI circuit feeding their Win440 PBX (not a Win question) and it has 2 analog extension cards that feed various faxes and modems. Every month or two the Western Union terminal (Model Tranz 330) which is only suppose to answer calls, will stop answering calls. We will go out and find that the jack has dialtone, the DID's are pointed to it, but it simply does not answer. We move it to another port and it starts working, but it back to the origianl port and it starts working again.

Now for the strange part... If we do a test call and it is not answering, we can clip a Butt set onto the pair in "monitor mode" or being on-hook and the Tranz box will then answer the call. This is true whenever it is in a failed state.

We have changed KSU's, changed cards in the system. Tied into the "electric ground", then tried a "building ground", was going to tie into Telco's ground today, but found that they tied into the building ground as well.

I have always told my customers "If i can duplicate it, i can fix it". I hope to live up to again...

Any ideas out there?

Polarity sensitive device possible.
Might try tying a single line telephone in with the Tranz box and maybe the ringer/electronics in the telephone will be enough keep this from happening.
I'm assuming you have verified the ring and line voltage from the Win systems analog port falls within the guidelines of the Tranz boxes need.

We have changed KSU's, changed cards in the system...

Have you changed the Western Union terminal? What would make you think that it wasn't the problem?

-Hal

hbiss is right. But, I had the same sort of problem. CID would not get read by the KSU on the line that had DSL. Filters in place or not. You ready? Left an old busted butt set in monitor on the line @ the KSU and everything worked fine! Tried imitating the butt set with RC network, no go. The customer now has a VERY unusual accessory stashed behind the KSU out of sight. You guessed it, an old broken butt set in monitor. I left that servicing company 5 years ago and I never did tell anyone how I fixed it. Hope nobody throws out that 'junky old buttset'. John C.

In reference to the KSU and cards being changed... the problem started around 8 month ago and then around 2 month after that they had a power spike which took out a power supply and KSU. On the analog cards, we have two installed so we have moved the WU to the other card and had the same failure.

I didn't think of the polarity thing, it's been a awile since I have run into any analogs that were affected by that, and since we didn't cable the place anything is possible. We di try duplicating a 2500 set, but it didn't help. Might be because it was cheap phone sith electric ringer, not a good solid bell, which wants more juice.

As for changing the western Union machine.. they say "we only support a dedicated line", which is what I think I am going to suggest at this point as well.

I wonder if there is a capacitance building here causing resistance to the ring voltage after a while. Then when you connect your b/s the charge is released and works for a while.

When it is not working, and before you connect a b/s, connect a DMM to the tip/ring of the STL port. What are the ring voltages? Does the unit start answering now while the multimeter is connected?

You can eliminate the PRI by calling the extension directly in the failed state and it continues to fail. Therefore, we know it is not a PRI issue, but a STL card/port issue.

The power spike isnt the issue either, it happened after the problem began. But if this just began out of nowhere.... there is a reason somewhere.

Best case is to bypass the WIN altogether and see if the problem reoccurs. My guess is that it does not. WIN uses a 98v squarewave ring tone that can cause some analog instruments fits.

I'd say that if they only support a direct line lets give them one for a trial basis to see if it clears the issue. can you forward the DID to a copper bell line on a temp. basis?
Also when you lost your power supply and KSU with the power spike, did the WU equipment get replaced too?
Let the customer know that its the WU equipment and put the ball back in their court.

We had some US Robotics modems that wouldn't work properly without a 2500 type set plugged into the "phone" jack. The one and only good use for a cheap K-mart phone.
Mike

No copper POTS on the premises. everything comes thru the PRI and pbx.

They had replaced the WU machines twice, both had the same issue.

I think your answer is that they will not support anything other than a dedicated line. Tell the customer that that's what they have to do because the Tranz people will have nothing to do with this problem. You have done everything you can at your end. They are saying that their equipment is designed for use with a dedicated POTS line so at this point that is what must be done.

-Hal