atcomsystems.ca/forum Forums TDM Business Telephone Systems NEC Telephones & Systems chrislebeck has left the building

Sorry to see you go. You've been incredibly helpful to me and many others. But I understand . . . under your circumstances, I'd bail, too.

Just incidentally, I'm 'just any IT guy' who doesn't have a huge budget to pay other people to administer our phone system. I personally think the idea behind keeping people from being able to fully administer equipment that they own is bullshit and I have no problem with what chrislebeck has done. He helped people who have enough brains and gumption to roll up their sleeves and do the work that others charge WAY TOO MUCH money for.

I would just like to add that I do appreciate the training that telecom people go through but let me state that most IT people (including myself) have a lot of money invested in our educations and certs as well. IT people 'share the wealth' gratis almost by force of habit, though. And perhaps because I am not a pure phone guy, I'm missing something.

So, if I stepped on any toes with my comments, I apologize.

And I have received a lot of help from others on this board as well, so my thanks to you, too. You know who you are.

Peace out.

[This message has been edited by Danno49 (edited August 12, 2004).]

That's not what were about, we just don't want printed material to be don't through email and not on the board, if someone want to give it away...well that's their right. It's not a smart thing to do, but they can't do it on the board, the manufacturers get a bit touchy when that happens and we can be held liable. What Chris should have done if he want to give it away or charge something for it was to personally email whom ever and take care of it that way. But we are also not here to teach folks how to do things to get around these issues which is why we edited his posts, we were looking after him also (which was never mentioned) What bothered Chris was that someone insinuated that he was stupid instead of taking it as if it was a stupid move (which is how I interpreted it)...he took it personally, and it was a stupid move. We all have and do stupid things, sometime we get caught and are called stupid and sometimes were just stupid enough to get away with it. I hope that clears things up a bit. We should get beyond this...cause it's petty...very petty. it ain't no big thing.
Chris I wish you and yours all the best as far as your private life goes, and if there's anything we can do that will help please let us know.

What I fear will happen is NEC will pull the plug on it's downloads & manuals because of abuse. 'NEC' stand for 'never ending changes'. I use the web site on almost a daily basis. They have warned Dealers that this is the case.
I don't want to go back to the days of waiting for cd's in the mail or files by email. Anybody who would put their companies authorized dealership (hard to get by the way)in question by distributing material in an improper manner needs to rethink their position.

in reply to Danno49 who stated
"I personally think the idea behind keeping people from being able to fully administer equipment that they own is bullshit"

When I sell a system it comes with full docs, admin programs & training.
If you didn't get that, thats your own fault.

By the way what is 'way too much'
In 2 -3 hours I could give enough training on how to admin a system & how not to screw it up. Most end users I have are frustrated when I arrive & are smiling when I leave. All for about 200 bucks. Most say it is the best money they could have spent. Instead of spending 1/2 a day just trying to connect to a system.
[This message has been edited by DrPbx (edited August 12, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by DrPbx (edited August 12, 2004).]

Well, doc . . . perhaps we should have purchased our equipment and support from you.

I was not in charge of that venture as the previous team made a lot of decisions with regards to our technical infrastructure that I would not have made. No offense to EE's at all, but I work for a firm full of them and they were in charge of the whole set up and not one of them had a lick of telecom or IT experience. They simply paid a whole bunch of consultants a whole bunch of money to make their decisions for them. In dealing with our current provider, I have gotten nothing but the runaround when it comes to support so you can see where my frustration comes from.

I fear I was lump-summing a entire group of people when I made my statement. This was short-sighted of me and I certainly wasn't trying to direct my angst toward anyone here. I should have made that clear. test-ok made a reference to stupidity (in fact, several LOL) that made me think of my own ass-showings . . . which I have done so in this very thread.

As far as too much, just about anything to me is too much. I am strapped beyond belief with the mere pittance of a budget I am afforded and I have to make do with equipment that is held together with paper clips and glue. I always shudder when I see a bill and I am quite able to accomplish 95% of what I need to do around the office if only I am shown the way on the things I am not entirely proficient or at least, serviceable in.

Anyhoo, I am not a big part of this community but I have found it to be an excellent source of peer help. Ya'll have helped me out quite a few times and I appreciate it more than you'll know. Especially, you, doc! Funny way of showing it by my statements but again, I wasn't being as prudent as I usually am and spoke on my own terms, not taking into consideration other's positions. I'm better than that but when I read what was going on with chris, a guy who has been a tremendous help to me, I couldn't just keep my big fat fingers off the keyboard.

In conclusion, I apologize again to any of the fine folks I may have offended that help out with people's problems on this board. Your help is needed and appreciated. Thank you!

[This message has been edited by Danno49 (edited August 12, 2004).]

I work for a nonprofit company which has a limited budget to work with. A third party installed our original five 2000IVS and NEC installed the last three 2000’s. We also paid the third party to purchase and setup for us AIMWorX, which they did but never got to work. We then paid NEC, which told us we needed a newer version, to get AIMWorX working. They also took our money but after several hours of sitting there reading the manual and calling Dallas, still didn’t get it to work. A couple years later we inquired from NEC what it would take to finally get AIMWorX working. They said more money and a newer version. So we did and then they told we were missing parts to make it all work and it was going to cost a lot more money.

With no previous telecommunication experience I get thrown into this position and decide to teach myself the basics. Since then I’ve figured out by myself, and all your help, how to get all of our 2000’s communicating with AIMWorX.

What I’m trying to say here is I’ve accomplished more with your help in the last few months than we did in several years, and several thousands of dollars worth of NEC assistance.

And after purchasing three versions of AIMWorX and paying several thousands of dollars for service calls that never could get AIMWorX working, I still can’t download a 3Meg patch I know exists. NOW explain to me why I can’t download a simple patch for software we bought (three times) and also paid to have installed (three times)?

If people like Chris are nice enough to take time from their busy days to assist people like me, any way that they can, with our problems then I’m going to take advantage of all their help… and be very thankful!!!

Which is good, great...that's what were here for...but it has to be done privately, not in the public forum.
I think a lot of you are missing the point.
If we allow this goodness to be posted for everyone to see the manufacturers are going to get us shut down by court order, and believe me they will...if that kinda thing gets posted on the public side where they can see it...so do it privately. Or this board won't be here any longer and there will not be any more of this:

Case in point. I've already have 2 manufacturers(not saying who) send me letters from their lawyers which stated I had to remove their logo off my site where ever it appeared. Can you imagine what the manufacturers will do if they see their printed material, (manuals) and patches/programs listed in a public forum that isn't their forum.
Think about it people, use your heads. That why we have moderators to make sure we don't get shut down, and they are doing a great job.

True however, you didn't provide me with an answer as to why I can not get a small patch for a program I purchased, three times. Or why I should have to pay for service on a problem three times with the answer, "you need to pay us more money because it's still broke", when I (Telecommunication Stupid) was able to get it working with only my common sense.

I’m not disagreeing, some things shouldn’t get posted. I’m simply saying Chris’s intent might’ve been taken too harshly considering he’s taking his time to help people like me for free while I pay NEC thousands of dollars for a puzzled look and a request for more money!

You send Chris a friendly email and explain your concerns while at the same time letting him know his input is greatly appreciated by many. If you’re afraid of getting shut down then simply tell him that’s what you’re concerned about. The guy’s intentions are good so I’m sure he can be reasoned with if you put your cards out on the table instead of beating around the bush.

PS. Hey it’s Friday, have a great weekend all.
PSS. Go Browns, Indians, Cavs, Buckeyes!

Sounds like you have a problem w/ the installing company. You call them NEC but they only sell NEC equipment. They may be called NEC
BNS or something to that effect but they are still an installation company installing NEC equipment. Aimworx has been around for a long time. Centralized call accounting has been around for a long time on NEC switches. Why a company who purchased a system & let lingering issues lay around for 2 years leaves me w/ questions. Depending on the service agreement sold when a system is purchased I upgrade software at no cost for anywhere from 1 to 5 years. Service varies from one company to another. We at CCC Communications(now American Comm. Corp.) give only the highest level of service & maybe our costs reflect that. But for almost 10 yrs there aren't any unhappy customers & we are given constant referals from NEC from unhappy customers that have called them looking to change venders. I'm sorry if you feel isolated. Isn't your time worth anything?