sundance-communications.com/forum Forums Wiring - Telecom Carriers - Trunks & Services Cabling Telephones Systems Wiring Question about 66 blocks and Cat5 Cabling

I am about to start a project where I am wanting to add new phones to an existing 66 block that has been using the older phone system from Meridian. The phones are AT&T 1014 phones, and they require more adept wiring like Cat5.

My question is whether its a good idea to hook the new phones into the existing block that way if something happens to the new phones, the older phones can be subbed in quickly so that they can still receive calls. The electrician that works for the company has told me that I can either stack the lines onto the existing ones (line 1-4 paired with each other) or I can use Wirenuts to combine them and use another wire coming from them and hook that into the 66 block. I have never worked on a phone system before, I mainly work on computers and do minor networking configurations.

Any help is appreciated, and I did do a search on the forums but I didn't find a specific answer to my problem. Thanks in advance.

Electrician and wirenuts...there's your first problem.
Honestly, hire a phone tech and have it done right.

Well, this project got dropped on me, and they know very well that I don't know what I am doing with this. But still, not looking at it as a long-term solution for them, would it work?

you are to be commended for recognizing your limitations and seeking guidance

to answer your question , yes it would be best to terminate the new cable to the existing 66 block if there is room or establish a new block with the new cable .


Im not familiar with the ATT 1014 what is it about it that requires cat5 cable ?

how important is reliable phone service to the business ?

I agree with Jeff a few dollars spent for someone knowledge to set this up properly beats downtime and troubleshooting down the road




BTW

I also am unfamiliar with ATT 1014 phones. Having said that, if it requires (and I have my doubts) Cat5 cable, and the advice you're getting is specifying wirenuts....

I would suggest going to the nearest tavern and drinking heavily.

You're going to need it.

Give us some more information and maybe we can help you.

But you really need to seek out a professional.

Sam

*gets back from the tavern* all that drinking didn't help me much, but I will be asking around to see if there is a phone technician that can do the job.

What was asked is can you stack them on top off each other on the 66 block, that answer to that is a big no, the lugs on the 66 block are meant for one termination only if you punch another one on top of it it will not have a good contact. As Skip said if there is room go ahead if not add another block.

Well, the only thing that I can see that the phone would require cat5 cabling would be that each phone acts independently from each other (the meridian system requires that the phones act through a distribution box), but the existing cabling won't support these phones (I tried ,no success). Course, I am looking around for someone local to do the job, been making some calls to see what can be done.

I think your confusing cable pairs with cable rating, I'm guessing these are four line no KSU phones and you need four pair to make them work CAT 3 is all that's needed

we have used CAT3 four pair for 10-15 years on new installs so chances are the existing cable will work if the jacks are rewired and the dialtone run to all four pairs

you can look for a installer here

another thought would be to have someone look at the existing Meridian system to see if it will do whatever it is you want to do rather than replacing it

The phones are AT&T 1014 phones, and they require more adept wiring like Cat5.

Who told you that, the electrician? :rofl:

Like has been said the AT&T 1014 phones are your garden variety Staples or Office Max 4 line stand alone phones. All they require is that all four lines be run to each one. Normally this would be through two jacks, one jack for lines 1&2, the other for lines 3&4. Each phone will have two line cords. Obviously then you will have to run a 4 pair cable (1 pair for each line)to the jacks at each location but this cable is nothing special. If the existing cable is 4 pair then you can certainly use it if you re-do the jacks and re-configure the other end back by the old Meridian system to connect each pair with a line. The electrician might have mentioned CAT5 because that's all they know- along with wire nuts. If you find that you indeed do have to run new cable you can use CAT5 but CAT3 is all you need. All you care about is that there is at least 4 pairs.

-Hal

I cannot find any reference to an AT&T 1014.


AT&T branded telephones beginning with the numbers "10" are the current "NoKSU" units manufactured by VTech, but there is no model 1014 listed on at&t's telephone equipment website:

https://telephones.att.com/telephones_ui/index.cfm

Like Skip said, 4-pair CAT3 cable is all you really need for those types of analog phones. You should also check to make sure your Nortel Meridian has the required hardware to interface with analog phones.

Yep...the electrician told me that :rolleyes:

I'm just going to assume that it does work with analog, since the older phones are analog anyway. I might try out the wirenut option, but I am still going to find an installer that would work with the configuration that we have in place (doesn't have to be pretty, just functional). However, the link provided doesn't have anyone close to me, other than staunton.

Btw, would the wirenut idea work in this case, if I had open spots on the 66 block?

AT&T branded telephones beginning with the numbers "10" are the current "NoKSU" units manufactured by VTech, but there is no model 1014 listed on at&t's telephone equipment website...

I just assumed that's what they were. For all we know they are 10 years old bought off ebay.

Btw, would the wirenut idea work in this case, if I had open spots on the 66 block?

Open spots for what? You're giving me a headache. Get somebody who knows what they are doing to do this for you before you knock out your phone service. Then you'll be in trouble.

-Hal

Well, you know on a 66 block (not sure if you do, but bear with me here) that there are 4 spots on each row? I really just want to get a pro to come in and do this, but they want me to "try before I do that" no matter how stupid that is even when I am looking at them going "you know, I think it would be better to have a professional come in here and do this".

OK, because you're so insistent on doing this, go ahead and screw up the phone service & put them out of service.

At least then you can say "See, I told you so".

If there are 4 pins ("spots") on each row then you have a 66 M block. If it is a 66m1-50 block then the two on the left are facing in the same direction and the two on the right are facing in the same (but opposite) direction. The two on the left are common with each other and the two on the right are common with each other but the left pins and the right pins are NOT common with each other.

If on the other hand you have a 66 m1-25 block then three of the pins face the same way and the fourth faces the other way and ALL 4 are common.

Do you see where I'm going with this? Just because there are 4 pins and 4 lines and 4 points on the compass and 4 winds and.....whatever doesn't mean much.

Also - You do know that you should have the correct tool to terminate wires on a 66 block and should not just bash them around with a screwdriver or hammer or the heel of your shoe? (Yes, I've seen all of the above).

And anyone who wants you to "try before I do that" is not a professional.

Please. Take a deep breath and look for someone to help you with this. It's not hard, but it's not intuitive either. You really run the risk of knocking out all your phone service. If we didn't see this every day we wouldn't be harassing you like this.


Sam

Besides the "phone lines" you could inadvertently jam an ALARM line, thus putting THAT out of service.

Don't know about your area, but around here, the last I knew it was a $75 fine...NO EXCEPTIONS. Think that's bad? What if an alarm line gets affected and no-ones knows, there's a break-in or FIRE...then who's on the hook for that?

The "Powers to be" had better re-think their request and expectations.

Oh, its not me that's insistent, it's the people that are wanting me to do it first before calling for professional help (i really hate accountants). I would rather not even try it unless I was assisting a professional out on-site.

Trust me, I have been getting on their case about how this is a very bad idea, considering that professionals should be called in to install this since its for a business.

Wire nuts are OK, just make sure to use the CAT 5 rated ones.

Seriously, though, could you be more specific as to the existing phone system? I can't imagine trashing a Nortel Merdian system (one of the best and most popular key/PBX systems of all time) in favor of cheesey import 4-line phones. You're certainly not going to be gaining any advanced features in the process....

Also, check the "Find an Installer" section again. I thought we had a lot of members in the VA area, even if they are too far they can probably refer you to someone local. You really need someone to have your back on this, and to explain to the powers that be what you need and don't need. No phone system, anywhere, ever, should be hooked up with wire nuts and it sounds like your bosses need this explained to them.

alchron, welcome to the forum.

CMDL_GUY is in Mt Sidney, ~an hour away from you. You might try sending him a PM.

Even though you admit you don't know what you are doing, you are better off than your electrician friend. Wirenuts and double punching 66 blocks are wrong, wrong, WRONG!

Tell the accountants that the tools you need to do the job properly are very expensive, and that that money should instead be used to get the job done. Also tell them that if/when you need help, they will pay a lot more for emergency service than for scheduled work.

Jack

if their serious about saving money offer to help them "crunch some numbers " instead

after all accounting is just addition and subtraction ...anybody can punch numbers into a calculator

right ? .

Thank you everyone for the advice, and I will be sure to let them know about this. I also made some calls to some local technicians, but I will be sure to PM that one guy to see about some recommendations.

BTW, did I mention that I hate accountants?

Yeah really...they of all professions should understand when and why you hire someone who is trained for a specific job.
Did I mention I hated accounting classes? -

Oh, I remember accounting classes in college (go figure, had to take them while getting my certifications which had nothing to do with accounting), very boring classes...

Buying a punch-down tool alone would come close to the hour it would take to do this right. Please hire a professional to do this job!!!!


Scott

alchron:

send me a PM. I know of a company in Staunton that may be able to help you.

Edward