sundance-communications.com/forum Forums Wiring - Telecom Carriers - Trunks & Services Cabling Telephones Systems Wiring Wire made Simple

I had a request for a copy of the Wire Made Simple chart that I used when I worked for AT&T sales back in the late 80s. That was during the time when most computer cabling was for serial terminals. I carried the chart around for years and wore the print off it and then I threw it away without making a copy first. I do remember most of it including pricing which I will not post here. If this guideline works for you and you need a price suggestion, send me a PM or post a request in the private forums.


Wire made Simple was designed by AT&T to make it easier for AEs (account executives) to sell wire runs with a flat rate or firm quote charge (which required a cable tech visit) and eliminate the after the sale and install price surprise when charging at time and material rates.

This is how I remember it. Prices included all connections including patch cords except for patch panel. Price was the same for plenum or non plenum.

PDS(Premise Distribution System)Wire Run
One Point to Point Dual Cable run (Data and one voice cable)to same workstation location up to walking distance of 150 feet across drop ceiling not more than eight feet high.

Single Voice Run point to point same conditions as above cost per run:

Single Data Run point to point same conditions as above cost per run:

Firm Quote: same type of wire runs but conditions are different requiring a tech to scout the site and provide a firm quote for the job;
Hard ceilings and or above eight feet in height. Runs over walking distance of 150 feet in length.
Penetration of Hard walls needed ie cinder block.

In other words, if a job required 25 PDS runs, we simply priced the job at 25 times x amount and that was the price period. Not 40 hours plus whatever per foot of wire plus face plate and jack and patch cords.

Reuse: Flat rate charge for reusing existing wire INCLUDING JACK:
Example replacing a Merlin 410 with a Merlin Plus.

Reuse including NEW JACK required a firm quote:
Example was a new system using 25 pair cable. AT&T was big on those 25 pin to 8 pin champ adapters.

I currently use a flat rate for both new jack and existing one.


I have been using this guideline successfully for twenty years. Some of the longer runs (same job) cost as much to do as you may charge but other runs (short ones) don't cost as much but the job as a whole works out.

Thanks for posting this. One question I have always had about doing flat rate per drop. How do you figure the sales tax? In NC the labor portion is not taxed but materials is.
Thanks Scott

In Va wire runs are not considered tangible business property..meaning that if a business moves the wire stays, just like electrical connections. In that case the sales tax is paid by the installer to the distributor when purchasing wire and other parts such as jacks and faceplates. Since I charge a flat rate point to point I pay the sales tax to the distributor for all install materials, including patch cords, patch panels and racks.

Up here just about everything is taxable. In any case, taxes are added onto whatever I charge for my parts or services, regardless what I quote.

If the client doesn't like it, complain to the government!

On the bottom line of my quotes, I just say "Total: $x plus tax if applicable". This way, if there are any strange tax considerations I don't know about, I'm covered. Sometimes it's a non profit or a county government job that's not obvious, or new work versus old work being taxed or not. Generally I know, but this is a nice safety net.

Jim

Check with your accountant or state tax department. I think you may be a little confused as to how it works. In most states you do not charge the customer tax on anything that becomes part of the building and cannot be removed without destroying it. You pay the tax on the material at the time you purchase it (and of course you add it into the material price you charge the customer) but you do not collect any tax from the customer.

So, the tax gets paid on the material and there is no tax on the labor.

-Hal

Sales tax, or price per drop, is still just a calculation. Say for example, you charge $80 per hour and you estimate 150 feet average per drop. Whatever labor you think a drop will take, say 2 hours, and you simply calculate $160 plus the cost of the jack, faceplate, cable, and patch panel or block. Retail wise, perhaps $60 for materials added to the $160 and you tax the $60.

YMMV

Carl

Except in Pennsylvania where EVERYTHING is taxed, including labor, in building wire, etc.

Rcaman

Just got off the phone with the North Carolina Department of Revenue. They said that their is no exemption of sales tax for any cabling electrical coaxial or low voltage no matter how permanent it is.

Scott, just wondering, during your conversation with the govt, did the term "capital improvement" come up?