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#561510 11/17/13 12:45 PM
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chazrc Offline OP
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We recently had a DEMO for a customer that is looking at an upgrade, either hosted or possibly the Avaya IPO.

The Avaya Engineer giving the DEMO mentioned that they are seeing many customers keep the hosted for about a year, and then get out of it. Also, he mentioned that they are seeing an increase in digital phones sold to enterprise customers that are tired of VOIP issues.

I would like to know your much appreciated thoughts on this.

Thanks,

Chaz

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Hosted systems are a novelty. Some small offices that think a telephone system is a liability will embrace a hosted system. Companies that drink the Kool Aid and go to a hosted system will be back because they realize a properly working telephone system is an asset and actually can improve business.

VOIP is similar. It's "the latest" the "bleeding edge" of technology. People who have absolutely no need, what so ever for VOIP are demanding VOIP systems. Again, the hype is much more substantive than the actual product. The ONLY place I see VOIP being a solution is a one cable to desk office. Then, the cost of a second cable for voice can be a high cost.

From my own experience with our company, we remove, on an average, three VOIP systems a month, almost all Cisco, and install an ESI product. IF the network is designed correctly and good, high quality switches are used, VOIP can work well. However, when a company that depends on their computers AND their telephone systems to work, the loss of one can be a real inconvenience, the loss of both is a tragedy.

When the people responsible for the system to work finally realize the problems with hosted as well as VOIP, things may change.

Rcaman


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I think that Avaya Engineer knows what he is talking about. We are seeing the same thing.


Jim Hoey

SST Communications
597 West Montauk Highway
Lindenhurst, New York 11757

631 956-0100

www.sstcom.com

Business telephone systems on Long Island and New York City like Comdial, Vertical, Avaya, Panasonic
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chazrc Offline OP
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Thanks. Great feedback. On the site that we are up against the hosted, they plan putting on putting over 60 phones on the same cable as the PC. The voice cables are not on patch panels, and at first glance, I thought I saw some cat 3 in there.

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The Avaya dealer is telling you what we have been saying for years. You would be wise to re-read and take what Rcaman said as gospel.

Quote
The voice cables are not on patch panels, and at first glance, I thought I saw some cat 3 in there.

That's absolutely perfect for digital phones. All your wiring is in place, no money needs to be spent for new switches or changes to your data network.

-Hal





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chazrc Offline OP
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Hopefully, they will go our way. A proven and reliable system vs.
the risk of losing quality voice calls, and as the Engineer pointed out, the risk of losing your numbers if that Hosted company goes out of business.

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VoIP - We will flat out tell customers that if there are any deficiencies in the network, VoIP will point them out.

Hosted - We have had some winbacks once the customers realize that the service is not there and/or they grow enough to where the monthly becomes a burden.

I agree with Rcaman. People are getting VoIP that really have no need or aptitude for it. Then when there are issues they go too far the other direction and will not entertain the idea of VoIP.

Like any other technology VoIP has benefits and drawbacks and is not the answer for all users and applications.

At 47 y/o now. Maybe I will make it to retirement in this field after all, lol...

Last edited by Meyery2k; 11/17/13 06:37 PM.

Michael Meyer
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If you put the right equipment in and configure it properly, VoIP can be a great solution. The issue here is that costs a LOT of money and time.
I really try to steer clear of supporting any hosted solution, because I personally have never seen one work 100% as advertised.
I have several clients running anywhere from 200-500 IP stations in multiple site configs that absolutely love the product. they spent a lot of money, probably 3x what it would have cost to install a TDM system. They do save a bit of time and money in the long run because they are not constantly paying for MAC work and can do a majority of their own admin on the system, but most decent TDM system have become pretty user/client friendly over the last few years.

My personal opinion would be to avoid the high cost of VoIP unless you can come up with three reasons you absolutely MUST have it. Most businesses can't.

As far as hosted solutions go, check out Freedom Voice. A pretty decent hosted product with NO CONTRACT. You don't like it, you can bail out with no penalties, strictly a month to month fee per user.

Good Luck!

D

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We are on our 3rd VOIP system at my work...Altigen, 3Com, and now Cisco.
Our network was setup for it, with separate cabling and switches. When HP bought 3Com, they promptly discontinued the NBX system and there would not be parts available after a certain period of time. We rely on our phones for business, so this was not acceptable.
We looked at several options before going with Cisco. I handle all the administration, adding and changing phones, etc.
Anytime I have a question, the CDW engineer or Cisco TAC is just a phone call away. They've always been very helpful.


Jeff Moss

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We have continued to rip out hosted solutions that folks thought would save them money, time and effort.

It ends up taking more time, getting service is terrible (ever called a phone company?), and it cost an infinite amount more money than a PBX. THEY HAVE TO PAY FOR THOSE PHONES MONTHLY FOREVER!!! In the last scenario we pulled out we were saving the client 25k over 4 years! This is what they see when you start to write numbers down and put pen to paper.

I think since customers now understand that paying for something monthly costs way more than buying your own (imagine that), it is an easy sell as we are now the ones coming in and saving them money.

Of course this is very easy when they have had the phones for a few years. If they are making their initial decision and you can't get the opportunity to show them the numbers, it is harder.


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